But they tried everyone involved with reason, right? Right?
Majority of wars started by the US started Like this. Is anyone studying history? Are you seriously surprised by this? Why is this even top secret, anyone reading knows
People dont read… Are you surprised by that? Probably not.
I think quite a lot of young people are dopamine addicts now from their apps and attention on those apps. So even if they have free time, it goes to that…
I’m assuming Trump will make up an excuse to attack Cuba now. Hell he doesn’t even need an excuse to wage war at this point.
Wow its almost like they wanted the twin towers. What’s a national tragedy over a for profit trillion dollar military complex and billions in oil and gas. Who cares if your expendables die that’s what they get paid for.
It’s actually a win-win as it helps to keep the populace in between fear and nationalist fervor.
Just wait until you see the one being planned to justify postponing the elections.
And then JFK blocked it and nothing happened to him and these plans were surely never implemented and that’s the end of the story
Back then it was the President keeping the military in check. Now we have to hope the opposite happens
The United States has always been the villain of the story. But they used to at least try to hide it behind a sheen of soft power. The only difference between now and then is that Trump unabashedly takes the mask off and gives no fuck what the rest of the world thinks.
they have alot of military propaganda and copaganda on thier side, so they dont look evil. shows and movies cant "portray them as the enemy in most cases. movies/ shows(reacher, top gun,etc)
“Trump says the quiet part out loud” as the kids say these days
That’s stupid. This is something that’s undoubtedly positive that’s being painted as a negative by people who are naive. The one and only reason why we even know this was even a thing is because the US is a democracy with some degree of transparency. Even if its decades later, we can still publicly view, discuss, and criticize things that the government has done in the past because those documents were declassified and released to the public.
Most countries are not like this. There are a lot of instances like this that will never see the light of day until that regime collapses, and even then its successor might keep the secret going. For example, Turkey is STILL locking up the Ottoman archives relating to the Armenian genocide more than century later. There are so many evil plots and schemes made both in the past and present that we will probably never know about because they will never be released publicly due to the ruling regimes wanting to maintain their image. I wish there was more instances like this from the US and every country so we can see the good, the bad, and the ugly and get a real understanding of history.
US is the Andrew Tate of global politics right now. They were a lot more subtle about it before though. But the core values that have always held throughout history are absolute self-interest, entitlement, and hubris.
Apply Gestalt Theory to the US and watch how unrestrained capitalism raised this baby from an idealist freedom seeker and into a narcissistic bully with self-aggrandising sophist reasoning and a pure Machiavellian outlook on life.
Trump only did away with the pretences, by firing the people who took care of the subtle masquerade. He didn’t like the pushback from them on global policy, and because the shoes already fit, decided to just do it live on stage without the makeup.
Unfortunately for US citizens, that means that they get to experience the splashback as he pisses on their international credibility.
A historically meticulously curated and maintained image that’s now irrevocably ruined forevermore. No sane person can trust a promise or a treaty made through US foreign policy ever again.
No sane person can trust a promise or a treaty made through US foreign policy ever again.
And yet the Iranians rallied and did some revolting. Since dropping South Vietnam nobody can have relied on the US blindly. People must be taking a risk and hope that the support lasts long enough.
Trump is in power because he does what the elite needs. I would like to know why there is no need to hide the mechanisms from the masses anymore.
Exactly.
Not much is different here than the presentation.
Soft power is woke, deal from strength or get crushed every time.
Not just the US government. All government. Literally all of them. Not a single human government has ever existed in the history of humanity that wasn’t the villain of the story.
I am not an anarchist, governments provide useful services and protections for their citizens. But lets not fool ourselves into thinking that any government is better than another, they are all bad equally, just in different ways.
I agree with you to a point. I would say however that it’s not the fact that government exists that’s the problem. It’s the fact that government is controlled by corporations and billionaires that is the problem.
Take all of that away and have a government is actually by the people and for the people…we’d be golden.
No, the problem is the people. All the people. Even if you take away business and money, which isn’t realistic, you still have to deal with the fact that humans are awful to each other, especially when they have power over each other. Government rulers throughout history have been horrible to their subjects just for the love of the game, sometimes they didn’t even get anything out of it. They just wanted others to suffer.
Look at Reddit, or even here on Lemmy, honestly. Is every moderator and admin some magnanimous and benevolent person? No, of course not. Moderators have a bit of a reputation for being horrendously corrupt power trippers, right? Do they get paid to be that way? Sure, some, but even without that they would likely act the same regardless. And I am a moderator here on Lemmy saying this.
There are not enough “nice” people in the world for a human government to ever work the way you suggest. And even if there were, there is no guarantee that they would always be that way. All it takes is one person criticizing people with authority, one person suggesting something those with authority don’t like, etc. No human government ever started from purely bad intentions. But the bad was baked in from before the start, it is unavoidable.
Can that be realistically achieved though? Any representative government is going to be vulnerable to the selection effects of people who want to be in charge ending up in charge, and those of them most willing to do whatever it takes having a competitive advantage. The formation of an elite class colluding at the expense of the rest of us seems like a natural result.
I think you’d need the majority of people to care more about others - including the unknown - than themselves, and to be willing, capable and able to see others points of view clearly.
That might be possible in small scale, I don’t think it’s likely to scale up very well.
In 1962
Does not make it less outrageous, but I thought it’s good to know it’s not a recent proposal
I bet there is a proposal, we just haven’t learned about it yet.
The recent ones haven’t been declassified yet.
In the modern era, the US president doesn’t need to actually have a justification for starting a war, just the possibility of profit.
It’s not a war, it’s an engagement of political discourse through military action to accommodate business interests.
that linkedin translator from kagi is working pretty well
Agressive negotiations?
Unilateral discourse, of course!
Because they control all the media. So their talking heads just make up some obvious lies, and they are spouted and propagated without being challenged by actual journalism.
There’s a lot of crazy conspiracy theorists who believe Kennedy rejecting the operation in 1962 may have had something to do with his head doing that thing it did in Dallas in 1963.
Obviously not the only factor. He had a lot of strikes against him for pushing back on the plans of men who weren’t elected to run the United States, but felt entitled to do so on account of knowing what was best for democracy.
i hate when heads do that thingy
That’s my favourite conspiracy theory, JFK’s head just did that on its own.
Which of course means there have been no recent proposals 🙄
Well 9/11 was 2001? Just throwing that out there.
The invading Cuba part kinda already tells us that.
It really doesn’t, if you’ve heard the orange talk recently.
I do my best not to. Fuck this timeline.
Amen to that.
Considering going after Cuba has been floated as recently as last week, it doesn’t
No one show this to Trump
No one read this to Trump
In a false country, their flags will always be false
you should make a distinction between Jews and zionists/the state of Israel, remember that not all Jews are zionists, there are many anti-zionist Jews who oppose Israel and their genocide.
Okay but when I say Arabs are committing genocide in Sudan, I don’t mean all Arabs do I, that goes without saying. Egyptians for example are not, Emiratis are but I think we can all make that distinction.
Not all Jews are Israelis and vice versa I know bro, I wasn’t the one who made the image. That doesn’t stop the fact that the ISRAELIS that committed 9/11 false flag attacks happened to be Jewish though.
I know that when a Jew does something bad that’s not a reflection on ALL Jews, same with Muslims, white people, black people, Catholics, Protestants, men, women etc. No shit
I understand your point, but please accept my comment as it is intended - well-meaning and constructive feedback. Blurring the lines between Zionism and Jewish people actually provides cover for Israel as it gives them shit to point to and say “look, it’s not about the genocide, our critics are all jew hating anti-semites”, not to mention that you make yourself a useful idiot for actual anti-semites.
I would recommend that you don’t share memes that blur those lines, because when you do, you just help Israel.
Horseshoe theory in action. I had check to see if I was on a neo nazi website, but nope, we’re on the very left Lemmy where saying Jews did 9/11 is now considered normal
No it’s not.
Do you think 9/11 was a false flag done by the Jews? Normally posts like this should be removed because they’re clearly bigoted.
I had to check to see if I was on a neo nazi website
Didn’t know the ADL was policing Lemmy now 🥴
I’m guessing this one’s antisemitic as well then?
Colonel Gadaffi must’ve been a neonazi as well then?
No one’s falling for your hasbara, ziobot
A country NOTORIOUS for it’s false flag attacks having been caught numerous times in the act, including RECENTLY in Saudi Arabia, and ACTIVELY committing genocide but NOOO them committing 9/11’s just a looney fucking “conspiracy theory” despite all evidence pointing to fucking Israel, just like how I’m sure the attack on the USS Liberty, JFK, the notion that they stole US nukes (aka the Apollo Affair) and that Israel’s committing genocide is ALL just an antisemitic blood libel because that’s simply out of the realm of possibility is that right?
The CIA is full of bastards now, but it was also full of bastards back then too.
Honestly I’m kinda shocked that they didn’t do a false flag to justify the Iran invasion. Back during Trump I, there were random drone attacks against freighters in the Strait of Hormuz that I would be shocked if they were actually from Iran. Did the guy in charge of that program get fired or get sent to die in Gaza?
Why bother with a false flag when they aren’t being held accountable for any of the blatantly illegal things they are doing?
Well, if the US imposed a draft for an invasion of Iran right now, it would likely lead to massive civil unrest - the war is very unpopular, especially among young people. At the moment, it’s a very distant thing for Americans, being told that you’re going to go off and die in Iran for the benefit of Israel would probably be the breaking point for people.
civil unrest is perfect. they can just arrest the protesting civillians and put them to work in the for profit prisons, leaving only compliant civilians. win-win.
I’m not convince it would lead to much civil unrest.
Playing catch-up, we’ll get one
Are they incompetent or do they not care?
Yes.
Well, we don’t really know for sure yet because it’s so recent – the US does have a ‘clone’ of Iran’s Shahed drone called the LUCAS, which Iran has claimed the US has used in false-flag attack against civilian targets in the Gulf. We won’t know for sure until the intelligence around the Iranian invasion is declassified, which probably won’t be for several decades.
Honestly, I think if this war continues to escalate, a false flag on US soil becomes more and more likely, to get support for an invasion of Iran.
support for an invasion of Iran.
They don’t actually intend boots on the ground against a mountainous country of 90 million right?? Right after Afghanistan?
Like they could probably set up a green zone in Tehran and then what? Just kinda hide behind the walls forever?
Afghanistan was a huge success. Rich people made billions.
Hegseth sent a couple thousand Marines to the Med, and he apparently thinks a ground invasion is at least ONE plan on the table. I do truly think Hegseth thinks that it’s just like Iraq in a video game, where it’s all flat, featureless desert.
Or, more likely, Hegseth doesn’t care about the lives lost, and thinks that we can just throw bodies and missiles at Iran to cow then into submission. That seems in line with his stupid “warrior ethos” shit.
It worked so well for Vietnam so why not
It would be the stupidest decision that Trump could ever make, for sure. The problem is that Trump doesn’t exactly have a history of making good strategic decisions, and he purged his administration of people who disagreed with him, and is seemingly taking advice from Benjamin Netanyahu. I really, really hope that a ground invasion of Iran doesn’t happen, it would be like Vietnam, except Iran has the 13th most powerful military in the world and has been preparing for this war for 40+ years.
Yeah, it’s not 13th in Iran, for sure, and with well-thought plans for basically everything. Only yesterday I was listening to the foreign minister of Iran spelling “yes” to a journalist question: “do you want a land invasion from the USA?”
Something about a land war in Asia…
First in command is Donald J. Trump. His XO is Pete Hegseth. Do I need to continue?
I think the plans to blame the Cubans for electronic warfare in killing astronauts is wild too.
They would turn an accident into casus belli
John’s version is going to be priced in somewhere. They’re too corrupt to resist something like an oil refinery to pump their stocks or the Texas grid to kill Tesla( and make some shorts kings )
